THE HON. MARK DREYFUS QC MP
SHADOW ATTORNEY-GENERAL
SHADOW MINISTER FOR NATIONAL SECURITY
MEMBER FOR ISAACS
CATHY O'TOOLE
MEMBER FOR HERBERT
E&OE TRANSCRIPT
DOOR STOP
TOWNSVILLE
FRIDAY, 22 MARCH 2019
SUBJECTS: Townsville judge; Australian Law Reform Commission's Review of the family law system.
JOURNALIST: Mr Dreyfus we have just had a Federal Circuit Court Judge appointed in Townsville within the hour. What does it mean to Townsville?
DREYFUS: I am very pleased that the government has at long last appointed a Federal Circuit Court Judge for the Townsville registry, after the efforts made by our very hard working and excellent member for Herbert, Cathy O'Toole who is here with me. It shouldn't be necessary for the Federal Member of Parliament, Cathy O'Toole, to complain long and loud in order to get an appointment made to the Federal Circuit Court. There has been disruption through March caused by the absence of a Judge, coming of course on top of the floods which have beset the city and this comes on top of the disruption caused by there not having been anyone appointed to serve as the Federal Circuit Court Judge here in Townsville for five months in 2018. There's a tremendous backlog caused by the failure of the government to appoint a Circuit Court Judge. Last year that backlog, I am told by practitioners here in Townsville with whom I have been meeting this morning, has not been cleared. I say again, it is a good thing the government has finally got around to appointing a permanent Circuit Court Judge to serve Townsville and North Queensland but it shouldn't have been necessary for Cathy O'Toole to complain as she has had to do for that appointment to be made. There's just one other thing I would like to add about the process for this appointment. The government decided that it wouldn't initially announce the appointment of Mr Guy Andrew, a Brisbane Barrister, to this job of being the Circuit Court Judge here in Townsville. Instead a press release went out from Senator McDonald and the LNP candidate for the seat of Herbert. That's a practice that I hope never ever to see used again. An appointment to the Federal Circuit Court of Australia is an appointment made by the Governor-General-in-Council. Its not the property of the LNP, its not something that an unelected person who is apparently running and trying to persuade the people of Herbert to vote for him in the upcoming election. Its not his property and its inappropriate even for a Senator to be announcing this. It is entirely a matter that the Attorney-General should be announcing. It is very disappointing to see that this Attorney-General, Mr Porter, thinks that he should leave it to the LNP candidate for Herbert to make an announcement. I say again, I hope we never see that practice ever again. Cathy would you like to say something?
O'TOOLE: This is a very welcome announcement for the people of Townsville. We have 300 families on a waiting list. So this is a welcome announcement but again Labor leading the way. It has been Labor that's had to drag this LNP Government to the table to see the urgency required of this city for a Federal Circuit Court Judge. It is really important that we have a regional judge here in the Family Circuit Court. So I say thank you that we have had the appointment made but again, how is it that the LNP Government has not been able to understand and immediately fill a vacant position to help those 300 families who have been waiting for their cases to be heard and resolved, completely unacceptable to be in that position.
DREYFUS: Mr Dreyfus the fact that the announcement came, Christian Porters office also did release an announcement, the fact that it has also come from also the Senator and the Candidate. Is it the case, does it hide the fact that it was only made because we have an election on the horizon and not because they are interested in Townsville?
DREYFUS: Well I would hope that's not the case but you only have to look at the way in which this government, that this Liberal-National Party government right across Australia has failed to fill vacancies in the Family Court, failed to fill vacancies in the Federal Circuit Court. It has left positions in the Newcastle Registry and the Launceston Registry and other Federal Circuit Court registries right around Australia vacant for many, many months. It left the Townsville position of Federal Circuit Court Judge vacant for five months after Judge Coker was appointed to the state District Court. I think its very disappointing and I hope you are wrong in your question in suggesting that this is only happening because an election is upon us. I would want to mention one other thing, just now minutes before we started this press conference, the Attorney-General announced the he had appointed the Townsville-based, although not as I understand it Townsville resident judge Justice Tree of the Family Court to the appeal division of the Family Court. That means although the Federal Circuit Court Judge vacancy has been filled there is now a vacancy for the Family Court position here in Townsville and its vital and I'm calling on the Attorney-General straight away to say what he's going to do about that Family Court position here in the Townsville Registry of the Family Court. Both courts are important. Townsville is a large regional centre which is meant to have both a Family Court Judge and a Federal Circuit Court Judge. The government after a lot of effort from Cathy O'Toole has fixed up the Federal Circuit Court position, it will now have to fix up the Family Court position as well.
JOURNALIST: So for this scenario does that mean that the new Judge Guy Andrew will have to be taking care of the matters that have now been in the vacant Family Courts and still dealing with the backlog, its seems like it has not been addressed if now they have to do more work?
DREYFUS: There are two separate courts, they do move matters between the courts depending on the level of complexity. The bigger problem here is as you have heard from Cathy that there is a tremendous backlog here in the Federal Circuit Court some 300 families are still waiting for their day in court, some of the matters have been delayed for between two and three years. That's unacceptable.
Its a basic proposition that if there is a vacant judge position you fill it, so that the work of the court can go on. The government gets notice when judges move, the government gets notice when judges retire, there is no excuse for not having a seamless transition from one judge to the next, and this idea that you can have 5 months of vacancy last year after Judge Coker left and more weeks of vacancy at the start of this year at a time when Townsville has been under stress because of the floods, that's not acceptable either. The government needs to pay attention and make sure that the people of Townsville and the region are properly served by the family law system.
JOURNALIST: Can judge Andrew in his role lobby more, try and push this case for a Family Court Judge to be appointed with the Attorney-General is that something that is possible?
DREYFUS: Its not really a role for judges to lobby the government, that's more of a matter of serving members of parliament as politicians to do, I'm a serving member of parliament as the Shadow Attorney-General, Cathy O'Toole next to me is a very hard working and excellent member for Herbert. And I know what we will be doing, we will be making sure the Attorney-General of Australia for a few more weeks yet hears loud and clear that although he has made this appointment today for the Federal Circuit Court but because he has made another appointment of the Family Court Judge from here who is now going to be an Appeal Court Judge, he's got another vacancy to deal with, he needs to be putting someone on the Family Court as well for Townsville.
JOURNALIST: Judge Guy Andrew is from Brisbane and he will be moving to Townsville, we were hoping for a local Townsville solicitor or barrister to take up this position. Should the federal government fill this current family court vacancy with a local Townsville lawyer?
DREYFUS: The question you've asked raises a general question about the process that this government has used since it took officer in September 2013 for appointing judges generally. It has been what I call a black box process where you cannot actually see how it is that the judges of any court are appointed by the federal government. They don't publish criteria, there is no application process and there is no stated interviewing process. That's very unlike the process that I had in place when I was Attorney-General in 2013 when we left office, that was a formal application process, a formal interviewing process by a panel and recommendations made to me as Attorney-General which I would then take to cabinet. Now that process is a transparent and merit-based process. This government has not used that and it means that where there is a person suitable for appointment living here in Townsville a loyal, competent and able to be appointed, there's no actual way in which they can enter the process. They have to really take a stab in the dark. I would call on the government to introduce a proper process so that it would be possible for suitable, eligible Townsville based lawyers to be considered for appointed.
JOURNALIST: So I guess its less of an application process. Its more about who you know.
DREYFUS: That's what you get when you have got a so called black box process. It rests on a conceit that the Attorney-General of Australia can possibly know all of the eligible lawyers for appointment in Australia. That cant be the case. You need to actually ask practitioners across Australia do you think you should be appointed to the court and so that there is a pool of people from which the government can choose. Although I am someone that started practising law in 1981, a long time back, I know a lot of lawyers in Australia but there's about eighty thousand of them. I wouldn't pretend that I could possibly know all of the people who are suitable for appointment and I think an application process is very useful.
JOURNALIST: Is it important that the incoming judge be dedicated to the Townsville region. We just had a person leave after five months in the job following on from a local who did eighteen years in the position?
DREYFUS: I am very pleased - I know that Judge Coker provided excellent service to the people of Townsville and the region and as you say he was a local - I am very heartened to hear that Guy Andrew has just been appointed to the position of the Federal Circuit Court here. He is going to move to Townsville and be a Townsville resident Judge. I think that's very important. I hope he has long and successful career here on the Federal Circuit Court.
JOURNALIST: How confident can you be that this will be a long term appointment and that he will get through this backlog quickly?
DREYFUS: That's a personal question that probably will have to be directed to Judge Andrew. All I can go to is the fact that he has said today that he's moving to Townsville he's got some family connections with Townsville as I understand it. I don't personally know him so I'm going there on reports but that's all heartening and I think there is difference between being a fly-in fly-out judge which is what happens in some places around Australia that's the nature of circuit court work that the judges aren't permanently resident but can come in to do two weeks or three weeks in a particular place. I think there's a big difference between that kind of judicial work and actually living in a regional centre like Townsville, getting to know the place and being available of course because when you're resident in a city you're going to be more available.
JOURNALIST: The Federal Circuit Court and the Family Court have quite large backlogs. Would a Federal Labor Government, I guess, make it, not a priority, but something you guys would do to maybe increase the number of judges we have here?
DREYFUS: We will be looking very hard at how to reduce the very large backlog that there is. We've got cases here and elsewhere in Australia, there are backlogs and cases that have been two to three years in resolution. That should never be the case. We all know the old maxim that justice delayed is justice denied and former Chief Justice of the Family Court of Australia used to say that her target was to get cases that were issued in the Family Court resolved within a year of issue. Now we are very, very far away from that now both in the Family Court and Federal Circuit Court. Part of it has been caused by this government's failures to fill vacancies. Part of it has been this government's failure to put additional resources into the family law system. Part of it may be because we need to actually make legislative amendments. There is an Australian Law Reform Commission report - the longest and biggest report that's been done into the family law system since the Family Law Act was passed forty three years ago. That report is going to be delivered to the government on the 31st of March. I'm hoping the government releases the report immediately although the form this government has suggests they probably wont they'll sit on it but that report I think needs to inform how we set about reducing the terrible delays that have been experienced by families in Australia at the moment who need the services of the family law system.
JOURNALIST: Will the proposed merger of the FCC and the Family Court create more issues?
DREYFUS: We are not convinced, we in Labor are not convinced that the Bill that is presently before the Parliament which would effectively abolish the Family Court of Australia is going to provide any solution to the terrible delays that are being experienced now in both the Family Court and the Federal Circuit Court. We think that other alternatives have to be explored and should have been explored before the government rushed this legislation into the Parliament late last year without any consultation other than with the heads of jurisdiction. That's not acceptable. The legal profession across Australia, family law practitioners across Australia and including family law practitioners here in Townsville have rejected that approach. I don't know whether the government is going to try and push its Bill through the Senate of Australia in the two sitting days that the government's decided are all that the Senate needs before the election but that's a matter for the government. I'm hoping that that legislation does not pass because as I say Labor does not think that is the correct approach. We are waiting for the Australian Law Reform Commissions report and we will be working with family law practitioners across Australia and working with families and everybody else affected by the family law system in order to make sure that we get the right outcome.
JOURNALIST: When you say looking at the backlog can you talk to some specifics and in your words the avenues to be explored?
DREYFUS: Well obviously any government that is hoping to reduce delays in the Federal Circuit Court and the Family Court of Australia has to look at whether or not there is a need to appoint more judges to either of those courts. It has to look at whether or not there is a need to appoint more registrars to either of those courts, needs to be looking at the project that is already going on which is harmonising the rules of those two courts. That doesn't require the Family Court to be abolished, it just requires the judges to work with each other to have harmonised rules. You'd be looking at questions like changing aspects of the Family Law Act itself if that was seen to be something that could produce the outcome of quicker resolution. You might look at whether or not alternative dispute resolution mediation processes can be altered, whether the threshold for coming to the court and what mediation you have to go through before you come to the court is something that can be changed. So there's a few examples, there's single point of entries been mentioned where both courts can, which already share registries in most parts of Australia can introduce a system that is already in place in Adelaide where you have a single point of entry to both courts. There are some examples of the kinds of things that might be explored. None of which the Government seems to have properly explored before rushing this Bill into the parliament.
ENDS
