SUBJECTS:Government scare campaign; Michaelia Cash scandal
MARK DREYFUS QC MP
SHADOW ATTORNEY-GENERAL
SHADOW MINISTER FOR NATIONAL SECURITY
MEMBER FOR ISAACS
E&OE TRANSCRIPT
RADIO INTERVIEW
ABC RN BREAKFAST
THURSDAY, 21 FEBRUARY 2019
SUBJECTS: Government scare campaign; Michaelia Cash scandal
FRAN KELLY, HOST: Mark Dreyfus, welcome back to breakfast.
MARK DREYFUS, SHADOW ATTORNEY-GENERAL: Thanks for having me.
KELLY: So the Attorney-General told us this morning this is a very significant drafting error, and the amendments which passed Parliament are not linked to the section of the Migration Act which provides for the removal of people. How did this happen and why wasn't this picked up?
DREYFUS: Well lets cut through the hysteria and desperation that we've had from Christian Porter this morning Fran. The bill that was passed by Parliament has very clear language in it about temporary transfers and its very hard to see, on a legal basis, how we have a problem here. The second thing is the governments got no credibility left when it comes to faithfully representing the advice it has received. The Director-General of ASIO said that advice from his agency was misrepresented and would cause damage to the standing of ASIO just last week. The same Attorney-General misrepresented advice from the Solicitor-General about the constitutionality of this bill when he tried to stop the speaker from letting this bill go through the Parliament. He asked the Speaker not to give the advice of the Solicitor-General to the public or to the Parliament and wisely, the speaker refused. And then we learned that the Solicitor-General had made a whole lot of qualifications and reservations. Hes got to release this advice today, and stop misrepresenting advice. And stop misrepresenting the law Fran. That's really concerning.
KELLY: Well we don't know until we see the advice, we don't know if hes misrepresented the law. Hes been very clear
DREYFUS: His record tells us that he will.
KELLY: The Attorney-General told us very clearly this morning that this bill was misdrafted because it didn't link to law 198H which he said is linked to the other bills that the government has put in place. He says that's the problem. And he said it happened because Labor moved too fast, Labor and the crossbench put in a gag motion. Did you move too fast? Is it possible that if you had a look at this, that this is not linked to the required law?
DREYFUS: We don't think that there's a problem here. We don't think that there's a problem with our border protection regime, which remains strong and intact. We think there's no difference between Labor and Liberal on border protection. And this is just desperation from a government that has given up on governing. Lets look at this. Instead of approaching members of Parliament, with what they say is a problem, producing the advice, probably because they're meant to be the government, producing an amendment to the Migration Act to deal with a problem they say exists, instead they have given selected extracts of what they say is an advice from the Australian Government Solicitor to the Daily Telegraph. Now, we've got a day left of government in this part-time Parliament. Were not sitting again until 2 April but that's the governments fault. It doesn't want the Parliament to sit. Instead of this posturing and desperate misrepresenting behaviour that Mr Porter is engaging in, why not approach the Parliament and do the work of the government, and get the members of Parliament to do the work of Parliament which is absolutely routine.
KELLY: On that front, as a lawyer, do you believe this could be fixed and is Labor prepared to work with the government to sort it out if there is a problem, a loophole?
DREYFUS: If there's a problem, then of course Labor will work with the government. That's what we do. We are responsible Parliamentarians. Were a responsible opposition. Were working with the government, as it happens, just today on amendments that the government asked us to look at last Friday to fix up a drafting problem in the Foreign Influence Transparency Scheme bill that was passed on June 28 last year. And were assisting, and it will go through the Parliament today. My point is, this is a part-time Parliament and its of the governments own making that there is a problem here. But we've got a day, and if the government approaches us now, and releases the advice and tells us what the problem is then of course well work with the government.
KELLY: Is it Labor's position that once treated all the transferees should and will be returned offshore?
DREYFUS: It depends on their circumstances and lets look at what happens on the governments watch. Some 900 medical transferees have been brought to Australia from Manus and Nauru and only one has been sent back. So this is already happening. Christian Porter has been all over the media this morning trying to run some desperate scare campaign. But the thing that hes screaming about is already happening. 900 medical transferees, and only ones been sent back to Manus and Nauru.
KELLY: There does seem to be some division within Labor over this question of sending asylum seekers to Christmas Island. Bill Shorten when asked, said its fine if they get the medical treatment they need. Richard Marles says its a silly idea. Which is it and is there a split?
DREYFUS: There is absolutely no split. The point of all of this is about medical treatment for sick people in our care.
KELLY: So whats your view? Is it appropriate for all these people to go to Christmas Island?
DREYFUS: Well lets think about this. We had Scott Morrison announcing in his desperate manner that the reopening of Christmas Island, even before the bill was passed its an unhinged thing to do he did it without determining there were any adequate medical facilities on the island. And you should ask the people who live on Christmas Island they have to go to Perth to give birth Fran. So if there were absolutely adequate medical facilities, then as Bill says, fine. But there aren't, on Christmas Island, adequate medical facilities. Demonstrated, I think, very well by the standing complaint of people living on Christmas Island that they have to go to Perth to give birth.
KELLY: And just finally on this issue Nauru has passed a law severely restricting the transfer of asylum seekers to Australia for treatment. The Attorney-General says Australia's ability to control the laws of a sovereign country are limited. Is he right about that and will the Nauruan law in your view take primacy over the medical transfer laws passed by the Parliament?
DREYFUS: Of course Nauru is a sovereign country, its got the right to make laws. But equally the government is in charge. The government is funding the offshore detention that is occurring on Nauru. And its for the government to make sure that there is adequate medical treatment provided to all of those in our care. That's what we have to keep coming back to, that was the point of the amendments to the Migration Act that Labor supported. And that will remain our position. That there must be adequate medical care for people who are in our care.
KELLY: Mark Dreyfus, moving on to the evidence Michaelia Cash gave before estimates this week. Labor's been hammering away at it. The Minister did provide the AFP with a Hansard copy of her comments to an estimates committee. She says the police didn't ask her for anything more in terms of a written statement and the Attorney-General this morning has confirmed that. So whats your point?
DREYFUS: That's not what the AFP and the Director of Public Prosecutions told estimates
KELLY: The Attorney-General said he had a look at it, a look at the letter from the police and they didn't ask for anything more.
DREYFUS: What a spectacle, Fran. To have ministers of the crown not cooperating with the police. The AFP asked Michaelia Cash for a statement, and she sent them Hansard of what she said in estimates. Its an insult to our hardworking police. And I'm listening to what the DPP said. The DPP said there was enough evidence to prosecute. But lack of witness cooperation frustrated their ability to pursue any prosecution. Michaelia Cash has to go. Its extraordinary that she is still hanging on by her fingernails to a ministerial position. But shes not allowed out, she doesn't give any interviews. And this behaviour is not what Australians expect of ministers of the crown. It should be full cooperation, full submission to interview, and the making of a full witness statement. And none of that happened Fran.
KELLY: Christian Porter also told us earlier he doesn't have a problem with ministers, in this case Michael Keenan and Michaelia Cash, not agreeing to an interview by the police. Lets have a listen. [Plays grab]. So are you satisfied with all that?
DREYFUS: No. He can try to spin it that way but if that's the way they think they can behave as ministers of the crown, it shows how low the standards of this government have sunk. It shows the Attorney-General has no standards, and they don't understand that as ministers of the crown, they've got higher responsibilities than other Australians. They've got to cooperate with other police investigations and Michaelia Cash and Michael Keenan didn't. That's the problem.
KELLY: Mark Dreyfus thank you very much for joining us.
DREYFUS: Thank you very much Fran.
ENDS
